tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post1886648790842266525..comments2023-09-15T04:27:57.129-04:00Comments on Commentarama: Don't Trust Those RadicalsAndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-90136727180667345642010-03-14T20:47:18.821-04:002010-03-14T20:47:18.821-04:00WriterX: And no promise to "serve," eit...WriterX: And no promise to "serve," either. <br /><br />Things were a little different for us old folks. We got the intro in sixth grade. Then we got a full airing in our "civics" class in our senior year of high school, complete with a local judge to expand on some of the themes. And believe it or not, we worked on <i>The Papers</i> for a full week at Berkeley in Poli Sci and nearly the same amount of time in American Revolutionary War history. We were expected to analyze, and I remember at least one exam on them.<br /><br /> <br />And here's the part you'll find hard to believe. In each case, we were expected to understand how influential they were in the creation of the first and longest-lasting constitutional republic in history. Not one of those instructors ever suggested that there was anything stale or out-of-date about those documents. Things were different in the ancient world of my youth.LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-13965451297516500642010-03-14T19:39:11.084-04:002010-03-14T19:39:11.084-04:00A warning on The Federalist Papers for students bu...A warning on The Federalist Papers for students but no problem in airing videos produced by Ashton Kutcher and Demi Moore? <br /><br />I remember spending maybe a day on the Federalist Papers in a required "Government" class. The teacher was a bore and a public school drone. The subject matter was always presented something like this: "Just read it; it's required." I didn't realize then the importance of these documents.Writer Xhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16505411188186283813noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-6532055917560648232010-03-14T16:38:36.787-04:002010-03-14T16:38:36.787-04:00Individualist: I wonder if they'll require te...Individualist: I wonder if they'll require teachers to read <i>The Papers</i> before they teach them. It's more likely they'll just get the Teacher's Union summary, with foreword by SEIU's Andy Stern and pseudo-historian Howard Zinn.<br /><br />Then they'll have the instructions on how to teach the children to tell their parents the <i>true</i> meaning of the sinister <i>Papers</i> written by out-of-date, white, racist, sexist, homophobic, ethnocentric, natural rights-slinging anomolies in powdered wigs. Values? Pfffft.LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-51699660827879154692010-03-14T16:16:44.367-04:002010-03-14T16:16:44.367-04:00LawhawkSF
As I think about this "warning&quo...LawhawkSF<br /><br />As I think about this "warning" my guess is that it will not be the parents who discuss the nature of the founder's racism with them and the cultural morays of the time.<br /><br />Rather it will be the teachers who do it under the guise of telling kids to mention it to Mom and Dad only after they have instructed the kiddies what to think and what to tell Mom and Dad. Knowing full well that most of the kids won't worry about it.Individualisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11005025873042230314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-47914163125706276022010-03-14T16:07:06.343-04:002010-03-14T16:07:06.343-04:00Bev: They want to change the ending of The Papers...Bev: They want to change the ending of <i>The Papers</i> because they're too bright. Don't forget that our revisionists think limited government and individual rights are dangerous concepts. Timothy McVeigh wasn't crazy enough for them, so they made sure everyone knew he owned a copy of the writings of Tom Paine. The concept of standing up against a tyrannical government is one of those dangerous outdated values.<br /><br />Kids: Discuss this with your parents (who are handing 40% to 60% of their income to the government, involuntarily).LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-55614911971701233592010-03-14T16:00:38.682-04:002010-03-14T16:00:38.682-04:00StanH: They were probably the greatest gathering ...StanH: They were probably the greatest gathering of Enlightenment figures in history. As I mentioned to Tennessee, the beauty of reading <i>The Papers</i> is they are not boring, dusty old treatises. They seem to have a life that can speak directly to those of us reading them today.LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-86016605371111655612010-03-14T15:49:11.873-04:002010-03-14T15:49:11.873-04:00Andrew: Anything that comes out of Al Gore's ...Andrew: Anything that comes out of Al Gore's mouth does deserve a warning, and we don't need to wait for historical context. "Caution--the contents of this brew will cause headaches, mental illness, and the destruction of your entire economy."<br /><br />I didn't know about the Sesame Street warnings. What were they warning against--prejudice against green creatures?LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-80106342043393275982010-03-14T15:41:45.600-04:002010-03-14T15:41:45.600-04:00Very inspirational Lawhawk! I read your piece and ...Very inspirational Lawhawk! I read your piece and went to the bookshelf and pulled my copy of “The Federalist Papers,” and like Jed will read the whole work now. <br /><br />It’s miraculous in my opinion the amazing group of men that gathered to fight a Revolution, wrestle through the “Articles of Confederation” and the eventual writing of the Constitution the most important governing document ever written IMO.StanHhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07395708786509590321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-48178082526138846732010-03-14T15:28:56.533-04:002010-03-14T15:28:56.533-04:00This isn't unique to our time. It was common ...This isn't unique to our time. It was common practice 17th Century, to change the endings of Shakespeare's tragedies because they were too dark.<br /><br />However, this goes to the heart of a major problem today - the inability to put understand whatever within historical context. What are they teaching in schools these days that we have to put warnings on The Federalist Papers? Certainly not critical thinking.BevfromNYChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14953050916932306270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-30262090189719563892010-03-14T14:40:13.616-04:002010-03-14T14:40:13.616-04:00This sounds like just more political correctness. ...This sounds like just more political correctness. So now anything that hasn't come out of Algore's mouth is a product of its time and requires a warning label?<br /><br />Of course, these are the same people who go back and re-edit movies and cut things out of cartoons that are no longer PC. In fact, they put a damn warning on the front of Sesame Street -- and that's only 30 years old.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-12502570431538927602010-03-14T14:29:01.344-04:002010-03-14T14:29:01.344-04:00Individualist: You're absolutely right, and I...Individualist: You're absolutely right, and I would add <i>Mein Kampf</i> to the list. Some values are and ought to be eternal. Fad and fashion come and go because they are ephemeral. <br /><br />Situational ethics (what we used to call "the ice cream theory of values") erodes and distorts basic values. "Thou shalt not murder" was a value 5,000 years ago, 2,000 years ago, and five minutes ago. Murder doesn't become a good thing just because a large minority of people might think otherwise. Changing the wording to "Thou shalt not murder unless the state thinks it would be better for everybody" is not an improvement on the eternal value. What's to discuss?LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-78639526158202527872010-03-14T14:19:27.378-04:002010-03-14T14:19:27.378-04:00Tennessee: It's probably the lawyer/historian...Tennessee: It's probably the lawyer/historian in me, but even with my first reading in high school I found <i>The Papers</i> to be exciting reading. Imagine, founding a government unlike anything that went before it. The subdued excitement of Madison, Alexander and the others came through on every page.LawHawkRFDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-75347435044775477472010-03-14T14:14:11.519-04:002010-03-14T14:14:11.519-04:00"This book is a product of its time and does ..."This book is a product of its time and does not reflect the same values as it would if it were written today. Parents might wish to discuss with their children how views on race, gender, sexuality, ethnicity, and interpersonal relations have changed since this book was written before allowing them to read this classic work."<br /><br />LawhawkSF<br /><br />Since Karl Marx expressed sentiments of anti-Semitism and many of the socialists of his day embraced the eugenics movement don’t you think this warning would be better placed in the front of the communist manifesto.<br /><br />Methinks I spy a casse of liberal projection here……. Hmmm……………..Individualisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11005025873042230314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4425587034622601550.post-42536677261680796142010-03-14T12:55:13.036-04:002010-03-14T12:55:13.036-04:00An excellent post, Hawk. It has been a long time s...An excellent post, Hawk. It has been a long time since I read any Federalist Papers and doubt I ever read all of them. Your post is prompting me to do. Thanks!Tennessee Jedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10604275115906776992noreply@blogger.com